EyeOnAnime Forum

IanC · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:45 pm Post subject: The Manga UK dubtitle list

Pretty simple, this is going to be a list of Manga UK titles that are "dubtitled" and how extremely (ie how close is the dub to the Japanese etc)

Please note- FINAL RELEASES only. Manga have done review copies with problems that were corrected in the final release

So far -
CONFIRMED -
Pre Starz Media-
Akira - original "limited edition" release (new dub only) (Hard of hearing subtitles only - need update for the "ultimate" version)
Appleseed (lets leave it at that)
Millenium Actress (going by reports on the previous version of the EoA forums, the dub is very close to the orginal Japanese, and if it wernt for the HoH bits it would be hard to tell it was dubtitled)

After Starz Media -
Golgo 13 (some subtitles when nothing is been said on the Japanese audio track, otherwise nohting too out of place)
Naruto 2.1, 2.2 *sigh*
Noein vol 1, 2, 3 (dubtitled, volume 1 close, starts to drift after)
tactcs Part 2
TOKKO vol 1, 2 (Americanisms and swearing in subs that arent present in orginal Japanese but are present in the dub)

NEED CONFIRMATION -

Lets not make any rude comments etc, i want to do this as an honest list Smile

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Gawyn · Elite Poster Joined: 09 Aug 2006 Posts: 576

As far as Golgo 13 goes I was watching a retail version of it. There are a couple of scenes where there are subtitles without any dialogue. As far as how closely the subtitles matched the Japanese outside of that, there was nothing that screamed at me. Of course I am not entirely aware of any other versions out there so a third party to confirm mine was not a duff copy from an early batch since I had it on preorder before I got it.

Just Passing Through · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:55 pm Post subject:

I don't get to see too many retail copies Embarassed

But one worth looking at is Noein v1. The review disc was just like MA, close to dubtitle. One scene has background dialogue in English, but not in Japanese, and the subtitles pop up for that. Other than that, they do *feel* pretty close to the Japanese dialogue.

Tokko, I watched some last night, and the prevalence of US colloquialisms in the captions was just ridiculous, and it's profanitised up.

Then there is Appleseed.

EDIT: The only release that I know of that Manga went back and fixed was GITS:SAC 2nd Gig Vol 1. What others have they fixed?
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IanC · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:03 pm Post subject:

Cheers, added to the confirmed section Smile

I noticed closeness in Noein, but not anything that really stood out. Maybe it is just like MA, very close.

Oh and TOKKO, was that a review disc? Im just been extra careful after tha 2nd GIG thing.
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Just Passing Through · Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:22 pm Post subject:

Yeah, it was a review disc.

I think GITSSAC 2nd Gig was a special case. The review discs were distributed almost two months prior to the retail date. That gave Manga a hell of a lot of time to fix the mess up.

I got hold of Tokko barely 2 weeks prior to the release date, and I assume that's the same for other reviewers. There's no way they can scratch a pressing at that late a date.
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Damo · Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:03 am Post subject:

So how are you defining dubtitles, I keep seeing the word "close" being used, if the sub is "close" to the dub it's not strickly dubtitles, if there is lines of subtitled text when no one is speaking in Japanese (audio), but there is someone speaking in english if you switch AUDIO tracks, then yes the subtitles are taken directly from the adapted dub script.

But if they are "close" why is it never concidered that both are valid good translations.

Litteral translations of Japanese are virually unreadable.

**Take "Tenchimuyo" which translates into
- "no need for tenchi"
- "good for nothing tenchi"
- "this side up"

So if the english audio says "no need for tenchi" and the subs also read "no need for tenchi" is it dubtitled or should the subs read "this side up" becasue that's what Tenchimuyo can translate into depending on how the kanji is read.

** I rmember all that from an issue of anime UK magazine issue 11 I tghink incase anybody thinks I'm talking rubbish.

End mini rant
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Toraman · Shinigami Joined: 08 Aug 2006 Posts: 2122 Location: London

Just Passing Through · Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:22 pm Post subject:

Damo · Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:42 pm Post subject:

Just Passing Through · Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 2:46 pm Post subject:

^

There's close and then there's close. I was just talking about the degrees of accuracy of the subtitle track, and the English dub with which it is supposed to match.

Now in terms of an accurate translation of the Japanese, that is something that I, and probably most anime fans will be ill-placed to judge.

However, since I watch a good percentage of my entertainment in Japanese, it would be fair to say that I have picked up a few words here and there. Enough to notice when a subtitle track drifts away from the Japanese dialogue.

Now as you mention, there are several titles with excellent English translations, that are close to the original language, yet flow naturally.

Millennium Actress is a prime example. I couldn't fault that title.

But then comes Tokko. It's a title with a looser translation, that shows up in the dub. One of the characters always refers to her brother as "Oniichan" [sp?], and does so whether she is exasperated or amused. But this is always translated according to context. And I've seen it as "What the f***!", "I don't believe it!", "I think so, but..." Obviously not a translation, but a way to get the English dub to flow naturally.

Similarly, when I do recognise Japanese words, they aren't translated at that time, but have already appeared a sentence prior, or will appear in two sentences. Of course in a dub the idea is to get a natural dialogue track that communicates the essence of the story. But dubtitles of this sort don't do the original language track any justice.

The final thing is the dub is heavily colloquialised, and profanitised. You're hearing Japanese and reading Americanisms, that's just jarring.

That's my problem with dubtitles in a nutshell.
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Gawyn · Elite Poster Joined: 09 Aug 2006 Posts: 576

In my view, dubtitles are as Damo stated - namely subtitles where there are no word in the original language but there are in the English track, which was the case with Golgo 13. Also those scripts that have sound effects added into them are usually dubtitles but it is by no means definitely true. Regardless of that it is very annoying.

One case of people accusing a subtitle script of being a dubtitle, despite there being no dub of the anime in question really annoyed me. This occurred with the recent release in Japan of Brave Story where the subtitles were not a word-for-word translation but rather a valid interpretation of the script. I picked on Golgo 13 simply because the dubtitling is so clearly obvious. I am willing to accept reasonable interpretations but there are always limits.

Damo · Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 1:28 pm Post subject:

Just Passing Through · Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 12:27 pm Post subject:

I guess you can add

Otogi Zoshi: Volume 4

as well as

Akira

to the list.

Dubtitles!
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Gawyn · Elite Poster Joined: 09 Aug 2006 Posts: 576

IanC · Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:05 pm Post subject:

Ill keep it for now then. That idea of changing interpretation style to suit the different eras is a good one actually.

What about Akira - i swear i read somewhere it was only one of the versions that Manga UK have released is dubtitled.
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